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Exhaust for our car A/T & M/T
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david
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Joined: 09 Jan 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 07, 2006 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

exhaust is not that simple, the right bent will give you very good performance.

seventh wrote:
Actually if you say a 4-1 extractor, i believe by changing the CC to a stright piping flow is also similar to a 4-1 extractor...

Im thinking of removing the CC and replace it with a stainless steel 1.5 inch piping.. I think i'll cost me only 100 buck or less.

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seventh
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 08, 2006 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya true...

I believe going to professional shops like in sunway is better.. they can give you professional advice and analysis...
If go to those places like wai yip they sure say... "Can, sure Can.. sure got difference wan"... Malaysia Boleh mah..
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shane82
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Joined: 14 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 08, 2006 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

seventh..i say that wai yip izit at tesco there??

i change the ekzos,piping and the piping after the extractor at there...firstly they say very good after install, got power, got pick up la and this and that..very good and no problem..after change, is a bit better la..got top speed but no pick up at all..than somemore, the piping alot problem now..the light for the ekzos is red colour, and than i go KBSC and they say i change the ekzos and make until like this..becoz they can balance for the power to ekzos..

now my car like lousy car. Mad
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david
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 08, 2006 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sorry to hear than shane82.

shane82 wrote:
seventh..i say that wai yip izit at tesco there??

i change the ekzos,piping and the piping after the extractor at there...firstly they say very good after install, got power, got pick up la and this and that..very good and no problem..after change, is a bit better la..got top speed but no pick up at all..than somemore, the piping alot problem now..the light for the ekzos is red colour, and than i go KBSC and they say i change the ekzos and make until like this..becoz they can balance for the power to ekzos..

now my car like lousy car. Mad

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seventh
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 08, 2006 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shane,

Did u change the extractor? Because we have a sensor at the top of the CC. Most ppl have this check light on after changing the extractor.
So, the best way is to remove the CC only but remain the original extractor.

Or, u can change only the rear muffler ( to reduce the back pressure when high rev )

Or, change the center box, piping & rear muffler BUT u have to have mod like Air intake , sparks plugs, cables and blah, blah, blah.. before u go for the exzos.. For the AT cars we need some back pressure to the extend cause the sensor will pick up signal to change gear and so on...

Actually just by removing the CC is good enough for the meantime untill u have all the mods done.

That's y we need to plan the modification stage by stage, then only u get the optimise performance.

But since u have change the exzos, u have to re-adjust / re-matching the stuff.
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shane82
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 09, 2006 12:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nope..i didt change the extractor..ok..maybe i try to remove cc..but wat CC mean?? Laughing i change the back muffler but the middle and the front i didt change..yah..i want to ask some opinion..bcoz i heard some ppl say play 2 muffler is better coz got pick up and high power and some of them say 3 muffler is good becoz its smooth and save petrol...so which 1 is most better Question


haih..sad..have to rematching again...

yah..yesterday around 12am i see 1 accent car(i cant remember is black or forest jade colour and rx-s or rx-s5) the ekzos behind change like darrenr35...i don know is him or not..the car no. is 7236 if i not mistaken...

quite nice too Smile
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seventh
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 09, 2006 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, you only change your rear muffler..
Here is just my suggestion..

If you have started modding your exzos then go all the way till you done everything with it but try not to change the extractor. just the CC (Cat converter) all the way mild steel piping center box then back to your muffler... dont worry about the power, work your way up from there at least your done with your exzos system.

my guess is if you done this system, you will tend to loose torque due to low back pressure or lack in some area. the second thing is the air flow system. you can either choose open pod or drop in to match your liking. Then there's CAI (cold air intake) is a must lar i say..get additional hose to connect from out side of the bumper to the filter element suction. This will supply cold air into the trottle body at the same time act as a air ram so that air is directly push in....

Then the third thing is the sparks. get the iridium plugs, and this nology plug cables where it has individual amplifiers to amplify the current flowing into the plugs. Increase the sparks.

With this light mods, i guess you'll gain close to 18hp on engine.
Then the next thing is piggy back or ecu remapping. Just say our accent is 89hp + 18hp form the mod is 107hp output. less AT gearbox about 40% is about 65hp on wheel. then with the ecu upgrade just say 15% on wheel lar... is close to 75hp on wheel. Thats like 105hp on engine output. from 89 to 105hp (just estimation). and if the stuff matches very good you might be able to get 110hp engine output.

With out this mod, the ecu upgrade will only give you about 8 - 9 hp on wheel only.
but after the mod, the ecu upgrade is able to get you 10 - 13hp leh...
you be getting additional 3 - 4 hp gain on top of the 10hp from the mod. This is like more then 20hp leh...
But i'll say you have to get ready at least 3k lar.
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david
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 09, 2006 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

our accent is 90hp on crank.

must dyno to say how many hp.

only remove the CC gain does not as good as well tuned extractor, proven for many years by many racings. too bad our car have this additional sensor, otherwise sure cun.

note: CC = Catalyst Converter.

these light mods never get you more than 10hp... 18hp is abit overwhelmed, prove me wrong by showing me a dyno chart.

Quote:
With this light mods, i guess you'll gain close to 18hp on engine.

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seventh
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

David,

This is just my estimated calculation.
wat i meant was 18hp on engine means on crank also. which translate to 18hp less 40% for AT gearbox would equals to 10 - 11hp on wheel lar...bro,
I do not need to show you a dyno chart.
This is the fact, the basic mods.
We cannot run away from this. It is in your PS2 Grand Tourismo!!!
And you think this mod is cheap ar...
Is better then going for the cyclone, MC, magnet and bull shit..

An up graded air intake system can get you up to 5hp.
An up graded spark system another 5hp.
The exzos system would get you another 15hp max.

This is the stage 1 standard mods for any1 thinking of performance.
The next thing is the ecu, cause most of the cars now a days is managed by ecu's.

Once all this is done you would be in trouble, cause these 4 system of upgrades is the cheapest and most gain of power.

In between this stage there is on way to get instant hp. that is NOS

The next stage will be pot & polish, engine balance, cam shaft, trottle body, and so on... and this also depends on whether your goin for N/A or Turbo charge...


Last edited by seventh on Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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seventh
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, coming back to the exzos system.

1. The rear muffler is kind of standard lar.. cause we're not VTEC or VVTI, or MIVEC so the choice for us is quite limited actually.

2. Cat Converter, I read this mag. was covering this topic of CC.
The test is on this OBDII (original CC), metalic core, ceramic core and a straight flow piping w/o CC.
And the winner is straight flow piping...

3. Piping system..

Ah.. have to get back to work..

Peace yo.
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david
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi seventh, for the sack of discussion, i have to correct you quote in terms of figure, worry newbies might set very high expectation, i write you those figures are not based on "estimated calculation", i see dyno results on so many car mod ppl put their car on the dyno machine with whatever mod you said:

1. intake system regain max 3-4hp
2. spark system regain max 2-3 hp
3. exhaust system does not give you more hp, only less back preasure.
4. port n polis + engine balancing + blue print max 5hp (additional)

the real increase horse power "gain extra" on top of your engine is either supercharge or turbo charge.

if you are argue with me by reading magazine and not done by urself, i guess that is abit paper theory only brother. one more thing, based on what you made the estimation? have you done any dyno of what you mod?

another thing very important is value per horsepower, if your think doing so much, what is the cost invested and total how many horsepower u gained?

no point to argue like that, do a dyno and shut me up!

no harsh feelings ok?

seventh wrote:
David,

This is just my estimated calculation.
wat i meant was 18hp on engine means on crank also. which translate to 18hp less 40% for AT gearbox would equals to 10 - 11hp on wheel lar...bro,
I do not need to show you a dyno chart.
This is the fact, the basic mods.
We cannot run away from this. It is in your PS2 Grand Tourismo!!!
And you think this mod is cheap ar...
Is better then going for the cyclone, MC, magnet and bull shit..

An up graded air intake system can get you up to 5hp.
An up graded spark system another 5hp.
The exzos system would get you another 15hp max.

This is the stage 1 standard mods for any1 thinking of performance.
The next thing is the ecu, cause most of the cars now a days is managed by ecu's.

Once all this is done you would be in trouble, cause these 4 system of upgrades is the cheapest and most gain of power.

In between this stage there is on way to get instant hp. that is NOS

The next stage will be pot & polish, engine balance, cam shaft, trottle body, and so on... and this also depends on whether your goin for N/A or Turbo charge...

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seventh
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks David,

The things is that i maybe wrong also because the hp increase varies from different car model and different mod setting...

But if you want to spend 150 buck to see a dyno for every little thing you change just to show ppl this is what you gain/have then go ahead.. no 1 is stopping you...

As for my mod, im still at the 1st and 2nd item which is not completed yet.. and after that i'll be goin into the exzos..

But what im trying to tell ppl is that get things done part by part, know the system and proper planning. And is not an arguement you see...

But i have to agree with you that we should not put to high hope on this light mods to gain hp but then again, it does give you more boost when your goin for ecu upgrading....
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noname
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

quite confused. you said changing the exhaust = meaning changing the whole exhaust system consist of extractor, CC, bullet, piping and muffler?

coz if changing only the muffler - wont increase HP. changing the extractor alone will increase pickup but high speed will reduce... give and take. so have to change the whole exhaust system only will see the overall performance.

as for plug system, changing to good spark plug, plug cable - wont increase HP. many expert in net already said that. It will only increase performance in firing system... more consistent and timing on burning the fuel... so cannot said increase HP but 3 to 4HP. Wink
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david
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Seventh, yes that is my point also, thanks for sharing. Our car engine capacity and horsepower expansion gap is very small, even TopGear also rated our car as Point A to B class, even more kaox2 also little improvement can be seen.

seventh wrote:
...

The things is that i maybe wrong also because the hp increase varies from different car model and different mod setting...


Yes, spending RM150 and dyno is no point

seventh wrote:

But if you want to spend 150 buck to see a dyno for every little thing you change just to show ppl this is what you gain/have then go ahead.. no 1 is stopping you...


Item 1 and 2 i total support and recommended, but for item 3, I am not very encouraging at this moment, we need to source for a most cost effective extractor for "real" regain of hp after "reduce" back preasure. Simple remove the CAT is just a temporary solution if your CAT is "koyak"... otherwise removing it while it is still working is a kinda of "waste" because our car CAT is high quality compared with Proton/Perodua cheap skates. It cost RM1.2k for a new one, so better don't waste it. If we take out the entire manifold (4-1 pipe + CAT) and keep aside while we throw in a 4-1/4-2-1 extractor for performance, then i recommend because we have a back up item.

Also noted when i take out mine for testing speedworks extractor (4-1) last time, our exhaust manifold is one piece, meaning we cannot separate piping and CAT, either we poke thru the CAT and make it like a 4-1 down pipe or use as it is.

Also not forgetting poke thru the CAT still have a lack of air flow because the CAT is like a pineapple tat will trap exhaust air output and slow down the speed of gas get out from our car. Not a recommendation but its last resort if CAT koyak (due to long duration) and we don't willing to buy RM1.2k new CAT and no available nice extractor suites our car yet.

seventh wrote:

As for my mod, im still at the 1st and 2nd item which is not completed yet.. and after that i'll be goin into the exzos..


Yes, agree on this, we need to plan properly, thats why i always tell my friends who ask me for opinion, do plan properly so that $$$ spent will not wasted. Also not to mention poor planning will also do damages on our car while suffer from financial problem. That was my mistakes before and never hope it will happen to any members here. Damn... i spent so much of wasted $$$ on Accent to squeeze its potential.

seventh wrote:

But what im trying to tell ppl is that get things done part by part, know the system and proper planning. And is not an arguement you see...


Yes, for information for max and obvious hp gain are either the following:

1. Turbo charge - BOT (Bolt on turbo), will get you gain extra 200-250hp depends on boost level (bar/psi), cost around RM8k-RM10k inclusive of piggyback/ECU + installation + intercooler + custom BOT parts + oil + tuning + dyno run + engine oil + meters etc...

2. Engine transplant - more cost effective way to get what you paid for. Currently EVO6 is the best choice, others Hyundai Alpha or Beta engine also available. But a risk of cutting chassis and others upgrade like braking, suspension, mounting etc... same applies to item 1. Cost wise... RM10k - RM20k. This option will make at least 50% - 90% gain from what our original hp our engine have, depends on which engine we transplant.

3. Supercharge - Electrical type, NA engine gain max 16hp, extra cost involved one extra battery, wiring. This one cost less... RM4k++ can be done.

4. ECU reprogramming/remapping - contact autosyn, price RM9XX, not many hp gain, mostly regain back 3-5hp (optimistic) for NA. this type of mod is like correction of engine mind due to local conditions on road, fuel grade and environmental factor.

seventh wrote:

But i have to agree with you that we should not put to high hope on this light mods to gain hp but then again, it does give you more boost when your goin for ecu upgrading....

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david
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

noname, true. once we remove our CAT (poke thru) or replacing an extractor, it will have high speed flow of gas rushing out, our mid box and muffler will suffer if we do not take care.

So, normally ppl mod cars on exhaust will end up changing the entire system, including piping (size is a different subject).

One example is my Gen2, up-to-date i spent about RM2k+ just for the exhaust system after i tested semi straight flow and now using straight flow with silencer (sometimes w/o, damn loud and garang).

But the point here is the materials used. All my exhaust are made in Taiwan and quality assurance is there, local made one i dun dare to use after many ppl in the forum (gen2club) complaint and unsatisfied.

noname wrote:
quite confused. you said changing the exhaust = meaning changing the whole exhaust system consist of extractor, CC, bullet, piping and muffler?

coz if changing only the muffler - wont increase HP. changing the extractor alone will increase pickup but high speed will reduce... give and take. so have to change the whole exhaust system only will see the overall performance.

as for plug system, changing to good spark plug, plug cable - wont increase HP. many expert in net already said that. It will only increase performance in firing system... more consistent and timing on burning the fuel... so cannot said increase HP but 3 to 4HP. Wink

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